Talk:Spectre

Already?!

Isn't it a bit early to have this page up, to my knowledge no official images from the set have been shown so we have no clue what weapons will be included, until closer to the release --RedRobinAlpha (talk) 02:41, 01 February 2015 (GMT)

I agree, if there are no actual (and legitimate) firearm-showing images that can be posted, making a page is premature and unnecessary. I'm quite sure the admins will concur. I've marked the page for deletion - IF there are images that just haven't been put up yet, I'll take the {{nuke}} tag off, but if not, well I think deletion is appropriate, as save for the poster image (which I'm sure will be archived here), there's pretty much nothing on it anyway. StanTheMan (talk) 22:00, 31 January 2015 (EST)

Sorry for being an uber noob but what is the proper way to post a reply? I sincerely apologize for making a mess of things today. Anyway, there are indeed images of Daniel Craig wielding what appears to be a Walther P99 which is why I decided to create the page. Here is an image: http://www.jamesbondbrasil.com/wp-content/gallery/sp_aus_150115/jbbr_spectre_obertilliach_150115_foto_daniel_raunig_003.jpg Andrewj28

And we're not allowed to use unauthorized behind-the-scenes photos. --Funkychinaman (talk) 22:37, 31 January 2015 (EST)

There was no content on the page. --Funkychinaman (talk) 22:36, 31 January 2015 (EST)

On a side note tho, I'm glad they're going back to the P99, the regression way back to the PPK in the last film seemed odd to me --RedRobinAlpha (talk) 04:19, 01 February 2015 (GMT)

What makes an image authorized or unauthorized? --Andrewj28

If it's an officially released behind-the-scenes photo, like on an official website, then it's fine. If it's some extra on set taking photos on his phone, then it's not. --Funkychinaman (talk) 02:49, 1 February 2015 (EST)

This would be authorized. --Funkychinaman (talk) 07:08, 12 February 2015 (EST)

A promotional image was released today, alongside a BTS video, of Craig holding a Heckler & Koch VP9. Looks like SPECTRE is going to be the first film to feature the VP9. By the way, in the video, as Craig fires the VP9, it looks like the slide isn't moving, even though the gun still emits a muzzle flash. --Warejaws (talk) 08:45, 12 February 2015 (EST)

A promotional still of Daniel Craig holding a Heckler & Koch VP9 as James Bond in SPECTRE.

Because it's directly after disarming a bad guy in the sequence it could be a stunt prop like the old flash paper guns. --cool-breeze (talk) 07:48, 13 February 2015 (EST)

An image in the latest issue of Empire magazine features a photo of Mr. Hinx pointing what appears to be a AF2011 Dueller Prismatic. Can anyone else verify? Here is a shot from the magazine. Here is the image isolated. Andrewj28 (talk) 03:27, 26 February 2015 (EST)

I'm pretty sure it is; similar rear sight, barrels and the side rails. --CnC Fin (talk) 04:02, 26 February 2015 (EST)

Wow, I never expected to see one of those in a movie. --Funkychinaman (talk) 07:20, 26 February 2015 (EST)

Hi guys, It's been a really long time since my last contribution, here I've uploaded for you a couple pictures :-) http://www.imfdb.org/wiki/File:Bautista_Spectre_AF2011-A1.jpg http://www.imfdb.org/wiki/File:AF2011-A1.jpg

I'll leave to you the honor of putting them in the article :-) --Purifier

Here's the new 2015 version from IWA (German Shot Show) a couple days ago http://i.imgur.com/95WqAg9.jpg , seems the exact version in the movie --Purifier 12:27, 11 March 2015 (GMT)

Thanks for the images, added them to the page. On a side note, what a god awful monstrosity! --RedRobinAlpha (talk) 18:27, 26 February 2015 (GMT)

For the times when you just can't have two separate pistols :D --CnC Fin (talk) 14:10, 26 February 2015 (EST)

Two new screenshots from today's video blog. Another shot of the AF2011 and Bond with a PPK or PPK/S Andrewj28 (talk) 16:25, 26 February 2015 (EST)

PPK

For crying out loud, enough with the PPK already! --Warejaws (talk) 16:39, 26 February 2015 (EST)

The 007 connection is arguably the only reason why the PPK is still in production, right? --Funkychinaman (talk) 16:47, 26 February 2015 (EST)

Agreed, never seen the PPK as more than a backup weapon, they started to go in the right direction with the P99 in Tomorrow Never Dies onwards, and even more in the right direction by having him carry a Sig Quantum of Solace, even if it was one he captured and not actually issued to him, would like to see them leave the PPK behind and issue him with a Sig permanently. I honestly think they won't do it because all the fans of "Classic Bond" will have a god damn conniption fit that things are changing, and cry that they will boycott the films until the PPK makes a return. --RedRobinAlpha (talk) 22:20, 26 February 2015 (GMT)

The man's still a secret agent, and he has to carry something that won't print while wearing a tailored suit. That said, I'm surprised Walther hasn't pushed the PPS on the franchise yet. --Funkychinaman (talk) 17:42, 26 February 2015 (EST)

Yeah in situations like going under cover in a party I can understand it, but there have been time he has gone into full engagements with the PPK, which isn't exactly the best idea. - RedRobinAlpha (talk) 00:58, 27 February 2015 (GMT)

Do we beat up on 007's horrible choice of weapons every time a new Bond film comes out, or did it just start with Skyfall? --Mandolin (talk) 20:22, 26 February 2015 (EST)

I normally like to have a little moan before every release, but this is my first one on this website, usually it's just me and my friends, good times - RedRobinAlpha (talk) 03:17, 27 February 2015 (GMT)

While I don't mind a little change for a good reason, change for the sake of change is hardly a good thing. And for me, that was all the switch to the P99 was. The PPK has its merits for who and what Bond is, more than that though, it's iconic, part of what makes 007 as we've seen and known him. Changing that just for sake of having something different would be a mistake. It'd be like switching Dirty Harry's Model 29 for a .357 Snub, even though there's more an argument for the change and less for keeping it the same, in terms of practicality as opposed to Bond's PPK. Again, it's a part of the franchise, the gun is as much a character as Bond himself in that regard. StanTheMan (talk) 22:47, 26 February 2015 (EST)

Walther does not have any real pull on the Bond franchise.Craig's suits in the film aren't even fitte for a gun. a still from Skyfall's gunfight in the Instanbul square shows Craig's shoulder holster printing badly. Frankly,if we look at Craig's gunfights in his Bond films, the weapon his Bond does best with is the Glock 17 in Skyfall, and one handed at that. It seems as if Bond&Co. have had a gun pick up brand in each of the Craig films:Browning HP,Sig P226in QOS,and the Glock in Skyfall. At least Craig's Bond picks up loose guns :)--Tecolote (talk) 02:54, 27 February 2015 (EST)

Besides with an IWB holster it is even easier to hide a compact or even a full size pistol under a suit jacket, but ideally you don't wanna be grabbing any which pistol from the ground to use, if he was to take a pistol that suits the situation better (ideally one that holds more than 8-10 rounds), he wouldn't have to be grabbing pistols that are kept in god knows what condition off hapless chumps, and then have less risk of the weapon jamming on him and taking a hollow point between the eyes, (and yes I know that wouldn't happen because this is a movie, but in reality you'd be surprised how many idiots don't clean there weapons on a regular basis, once had a friend whose Hi-Power wouldn't even cycle because of all the crap inside it, he had to manually work the slide after every shot and he had no idea why) - RedRobinAlpha (talk) 14:49, 27 February 2015 (GMT)

We all know why it has to have a PPK. It's so iconic that you can't have a Bond spy movie without the PPK. It' pretty much a sin. Yeah for a modern day practical purposes, he should have other guns. In one of the books, his favorite is actually the ASP Excalibur01 (talk) 15:12, 27 February 2015 (EST)

The ASP is arguably worse than the PPK. Sure its 9x19, but it doesn't really have sights and spare parts will be impossible to come by. Why can't British writers do guns decently?--Mandolin (talk) 19:06, 27 February 2015 (EST)

Totally agree that the PPK isn't suitable for the kind of adventures Bond get himself into. Real life secret agents use them precisely because they are NOT like bond. They don't shoot often and need maximum discretion. Bond practically announces himself everywhere he goes and shoots very often. As for the ASP, its design has become too dated, and there are many other firearms that can replace it. The Glock 26, Walther CCP, Beretta Px4 Storm, Sig P938, etc. are all excellent compact designs in 9mm with good firepower. Some of them even have nice flowing lines to boot. But for serious gunfighters, they will probably use a larger pistol such as the P99 or Glock 19.

It’s odd that they bought the PPK back in Quantum of Solace. Just about all the Bond movies from 1995’s GoldenEye onwards have a tendency to have some character (*cough* Judi Dench *cough* M *cough*) remind Bond - and the audience - that cold war is over. Considering that Skyfall had pretty hefty symbolism with “death of Bond” in the beginning and the destruction of the iconic Aston Martin from Goldfinger in the end, pretty much telling that the old Bond is dead and it’s time to finally start a new era. So with all that telling that “cold war is over and it’s a new age” BS, why are they still making him stick with that cold war - hell, World War II – relic after all this? I say; if they want to rise out of the nostalgic dumps of cold war, Bond needs to get rid of the PPK. It’s the last thing keeping him from getting over his roots. His Eisenhower vs Khrushchev era Cold War roots. TrickShotFinn (talk) 13:18, 28 February 2015 (EST)

I remember in some of the novels in the 80's they "updated" his carry weapon at first to an early FN model (1903 I think) and then to a VP70 (which I'd love to see him use in a film) before settling on the ASP for the remainder of the 80's and through the mid 90's, and in the Deaver novel "Carte Blanche" he carries the PPS, so the PPk isn't as much of the James Bond mythos as a lot of people think. I for one agree that it's time to get rid of the antique PPK and replace it, at least, with the PPS but ideally with the Sig P226R as it is used by the rest of the British armed forces (although I think SIS issues either Glock 17, Browning 9mm, or the PP9) - RedRobinAlpha (talk) 19:49, 28 February 2015 (GMT)

Bah, whatever the books describe, we're still talking about the films here, and Bond has carried the PPK in all but a few of them. I don't see how keeping the PPK makes him worse off, nor do I see what a big improvement changing it would do for the character or franchise. 'New' Bond? We've arguably had 'new' Bonds ever since Sean Connery stopped playing the role. It's not being nostalgic - Again, that gun has become an iconic and relatively consistent part of the film franchise, much like his 'shaken, not stirred' martinis. To just change something like that out of hand would be silly. They have changed his sidearms, but his use of the P99 and P5 were little more than advertising plugs by Walther (though I thought the P99 was a nice change) - It's clear changing his sidearm has done relatively little to have him "rise out of the nostalgic dumps", as you say, and I think that will still hold true. Part of the problem is that Bond himself is a product of his time, you'll never really eliminate that aspect completely, no matter what.

Granted I don't really care whether he keeps it or not, but I don't get all the hostility for him keeping a "WWII relic", mainly the implication that carrying something "antique" is a drawback for that reason alone - How many 'modern' parties swear by the 1911 design still? It's older than the Walther PP or PPK. More than a century old now. Do you have something against a weapon's age? If that isn't it, and you want the franchise to truly and wholly update Bond with a new sidearm, well that's fine. I personally don't see what the big deal is over him still carrying the sidearm that most everyone still almost universally associates with 007/James Bond (and still certainly works as far as a concealable compact firearm needs to work). I also don't see the big deal over changing it either so much. Whatever either way. StanTheMan (talk) 22:38, 28 February 2015 (EST)

Ouch. I didn’t mean to strike a nerve. And I don’t have anything against PPK – it’s a sexy f***ing gun - even though re-reading my post, it kinda-sorta does sound like it. Me and my non-native English speaker wording. Eep. What I tried to get across is that the movies themselves have been bit insistent in trying to get over the “Bond is a symbol of cold war” image and suddenly going back to the PPK in QoS over the P99 that Bond carried from end of 1997's Tomorrow Never Dies to 2006's Casino Royale isn’t quite consistent with their line of though. Did they bring the PPK back just so they could eventually recreate the gun swap scene from Dr.No in close future in post reboot canon? TrickShotFinn (talk) 13:03, 1 March 2015 (EST)

Oh it's ok, I wasn't sure either, but I wanted to make a note. It's cool man. As for switching back to the PPK, I don't know what's really up with that either. Like I said, I get your point about updating the character and franchise, as well as your point about the inconsistencies. But as said above, having a Bond film without a PPK (or at least, a Walther) would be almost sacrilege to some at this point. Again, I don't really care that much either way but that aspect is still there. What can ya do? I certainly would prefer if he stuck with a Walther, personally - Though I'd have thought they'd stick with the P99. Again though, what can ya do? StanTheMan (talk) 15:38, 1 March 2015 (EST)

Are we sure that's a PPK/S in the single still to be be released so far and not a standard PPK?--Tecolote (talk) 23:43, 28 February 2015 (EST)

It's impossible to tell from the angle of the picture, I only put it as the PPK/S because it was the weapon used in the last film and will most likely be the same in this one, if another picture surfaces that show that it isn't then I'll change it. - RedRobinAlpha (talk) 17:07, 01 March 2015 (GMT)

I've said it before when this discussion erupted for Skyfall and I'll say it again--we're missing the point. It doesn't matter what pistol is the most reliable, relevant, perfect CCW. It's Bond. 007. Sharp tuxes. Aston Martins. Walthers. It's just part of his character. I'm a die hard SIG fan, but if Bond carried a P224 in Spectre I might just have to boycott the movie. Just as he has to drive an Aston Martin, Bond simply has to carry a Walther. I still think he should switch between a P99 and either a PPK or PPS depending on the situation, but those are the only acceptable choices. I think people are just wanting to see pistols that are their personal favorites, which also happen to fall under the "improvement to a PPK" category. The Bond films aren't about realism, they never really have been. It's about lighthearted badassery.----JazzBlackBelt-- (talk) 21:23, 2 March 2015 (EST)

Well said JazzBlackBelt. Well said. --Jcordell (talk) 22:23, 21 March 2015 (EDT)

Not a PPK/S afterall

So according to a member over at waltherforums who is apparently in the know, the PPK/S used in Skyfall was really just a PPK. The /S tacked onto the end of it was actually the writers way of designating it as a "Signature" model or micro dermal sensor model. They were completely unaware that Walther actually produces a real PPK/S model. So suppose in Skyfall Bond was issued a micro dermal sensored P99 in the museum by Q, he would have likely called it a P99/S. It was all just a coincidence.

The reason I post this here is because he went on to say that the same resin prop PPK gun used in Skyfall was used in the SPECTRE teaser poster. So if this is all true (he also provided several images of the props so it may very well be), then these pages may need to be updated. Andrewj28 (talk) 20:33, 25 March 2015 (EDT)

Had a good look at some images from Skyfall and some comparing the PPK to the PPK/S and made this crude (really crude, sorry) comparison between the PPK (Red circle) and PPK/S (Green circle) along side an image from Skyfall, and it looks like the one used was in fact a PPK/S. The difference is minute (flat edge on the PPK/s and slight beveled edge on the PPK), but definitely there. --RedRobinAlpha (talk) 01:37, 26 March 2015 (GMT)

I had found this pic of the custom Walther used on the set of Skyfall and it clearly shows that the Walther was a PPK not a PPK/S--Gunfan2818 (talk) 03:29, 26 March 2015 (EDT)

Well I stand corrected, nice find. --RedRobinAlpha (talk) 12:19, 26 March 2015 (GMT)

Here is a quote from the waltherforums member regarding the concept images above "These concept designs show that the two switches allowed the software chip containing the users preferences to be removed. Originally the pistol had more functions like double-tap one trigger pull etc. Again it was another coincidence that the design looked like the S&W model with beavertail. In reality, the signature grips were that severely cutting into the frame and spring that it would make a real PPK non operational, so all the PPK/S's you see are 3D printed models, non functioning with radio operated LED's. the only time you see a real PPK here is when Bond is in teh car and activates it for the first time." Andrewj28 (talk) 15:18, 26 March 2015 (EDT)

As mentioned above, when we see Bond activate the "Signature" gun in the car after tailing Patrice in Shanghai, that is a real PPK with a custom grip sleeve slipped in place of normal grips. Below is a photo the member has provided me of the grip sleeve on a real PPK. He noted thatit is a bit battered and the buttons have come off, but the LED activation still works. Also, he told me a PP magazine was used to house the electronics since a PPK mag would no longer fit (due to the length of the grip). Andrewj28 (talk) 15:42, 26 March 2015 (EDT)

AFAIK, the PPK/S only exists to get around GCA 1968, so would they even be available outside the US? --Funkychinaman (talk) 15:27, 26 March 2015 (EDT)

Good question. I'm not sure. Andrewj28 (talk) 15:42, 26 March 2015 (EDT)

Arsenal Firearms LRC-2

New official image from the set of SPECTRE. Bond is reportedly carrying an Arsenal Firearms LRC-2. Andrewj28 (talk) 07:17, 28 March 2015 (EDT)

Thanks for sharing, I've added it to the page. --RedRobinAlpha (talk) 18:36, 28 March 2015 (GMT)

I dont think that is right, the top rail has a break for the ejection port whereas the LRC-2 has a continuous rail. To me it looks more like a KPOS conversion kit:

A Glock pistol fitted in a FAB Defense KPOS Glock to Carbine PDW Conversion Kit

There are a few other differences as well such as it lacking the AR-15 style charging handle of the LRC-2, the stock being different, and the general overall proportions being closer to the KPOS (to my eye anyway), but the rail is the most obvious one. --commando552 (talk) 07:58, 23 July 2015 (EDT)

If the carbine conversion is a AF LRC-2 it normally comes with a fluted 12 inch replacement barrel. If it is a LRC-2, the only gun that fits into this FAB Defense produced kit is the Arsenal Firearms Strike One. I should know, as I am the regional importer and distributor. I also don't think this is a LRC-2. The gun in the still seems to be equipped with BUIS and a black ATPIAL(AN/PEQ-15) on the right forward rail. --Warrernoia (talk) 18:48, 23 July 2015 (GMT)

Here's a Screencap from the latest trailer. As mentioned above, it does indeed appear to be a FAB Defense KPOS rather than a LRC-2. Andrewj28 (talk) 22:44, 7 October 2015 (EDT)

New firearm from Morocco scenes

In the newest TV spot, Bond is seen shouldering a new firearm. I have yet to find an HD version of the TV spot to screenshot it but fortunately a clearer view of the gun was published in Event Magazine (link). Can anyone identify it? Andrewj28 (talk) 23:31, 28 September 2015 (EDT)

Not positive but it looks like the shortened VZ.58 compact rifles seen in Strike Back Season 4. --ThePotShot (talk) 01:58, 29 September 2015 (EDT)

I agree, appears to be VZ58 compact in 5.56x45mm --CnC Fin (talk) 06:11, 29 September 2015 (EDT)

Here's a higher resolution screencap of the suspected vz.58 SBR from the final trailer Andrewj28 (talk) 22:30, 7 October 2015 (EDT)

Guns not (yet) listed on the moviepage

Was privileged enough to see this movie last night when it premiered in Holland. Much work has been done already on this page, but for future reference, I am listing the guns that should still be added in due course:

• SIG-Sauer P226R: given to Madeleine by Bond in the train scene, he specifically refers to it as the 'SIG-Sauer P226'.
• Steyr AUG A3: Bond picks it up from a display at Q's underground laboratory.
• H&K G3 (?): full-sized assault rifle with silencer leaning against a wall to the left of the big clipboard in the Tangiers safehouse.

By the way, you guys are 100% right about the vz. 58 SBR, one is seen in the Tangiers safehouse and it gets plenty of showtime in the Morocco scenes! - PeeWee055 (talk) 06:56, 30 October 2015 (EDT)

Things that bugged me

Apparently James Bond in this movie keeps his Walther in condition 3 because every time I takes it out, he's racking the slide. The other thing is in Mexico City where he turns on a "laser" to help aim and that's what gave his position away...really really stupid moment for a Bond movie. Excalibur01 (talk) 22:47, 7 November 2015 (EST)

The "laser" was a laser microphone which I believe was visible so that the audience could tell what it was being used for, while the other characters couldn't see it. The men in the meeting were unaware of him until he decided to open fire. Not disagreeing though with how he kept his Walther though. Probably done for dramatic effect. --HazeGray&Underway (talk) 17:24, 8 November 2015 (EST)

I was paying real attention to when he turned on the laser and it clearly showed the bad guys reacting to seeing the laser and turning to open fire on Bond first before he returned fire Excalibur01 (talk) 22:29, 8 November 2015 (EST)

I haven't actually seen the movie yet, so I can't comment on the laser, but I don't see the problem with Bond carrying condition 3, lots of people do, I wouldn't personally, but that's my choice --RedRobinAlpha (talk) 23:41, 08 November 2015 (GMT)